Helo with Iranian President hits side of mountain

Mutiger

Mutiger

Filing Flight Plan
Joined
Sep 15, 2020
Messages
6
Display Name
Display name:
Mutiger
Amazing people of such importance can be flown into a mountain. Is it poor/inexperienced pilots or do they just fly IFR without ATC over there? How does this happen?
 
So I wasn't a fan of Raisi but I'm also not a fan of fatal aviation accidents...

So... What do we think brought the helicopter down?
Weather seems like the obvious culprit with photos from the region looking foggy as all hell. But I'm guessing the guy ferrying the president and foreign minister around isn't a hack of a pilot, and I'm wondering how likely it is he would have crashed them into a mountain?

It goes without saying but it just seems like a hell of an interesting time to have these particular people crash and die this way... Reminds me of the unfortunate, unscheduled rapid disassembly of Prigozhin's jet last year...


A few bits of speculation the media:
“You have fog, you have rain, you have cold temperatures, with temperatures below 50 degrees Fahrenheit (10 degrees Celsius) you find that there's the possibility at higher altitudes of icing of the rotor blades"
"There's a possibility of potentially engine failure, so there are a lot of different things that could in fact, have been part of this.”
“The other factor in this would be maintenance — whether or not the helicopter was properly maintained.”
 
Last edited:
ArrowFlyer86 said:
But I'm guessing the guy ferrying the president and foreign minister around isn't a hack of a pilot, and I'm wondering how likely it is he would have crashed them into a mountain?
Click to expand...
I'm guessing the guy ferrying Kobe around wasn't a hack of a pilot either, but helicopters seem to invite risky flying.

Couldn't have happened to a nicer guy. I don't know a lot about Iranian politics, but I'm guessing nothing changes so long as Khameini is around.
 
Last edited:
They might not have been Iranian pilots. A lot of your middle eastern countries don’t use native pilots. They’re mostly foreigners flying there on contract. When I was in Afghanistan, President Karzai flew on Afghan MI-17s flown by American pilots. I flew him once in our aircraft as well.

The weather at the site seems to indicate the obvious. Just like the recent (CH-53/ EC-130) accidents out west in the US. Sniffing around the mountains with low ceilings is a dangerous proposition with a helicopter.
 
Mutiger said:
How does this happen?
Click to expand...
Same reasons it happens here. 10 to 1 they were scud running and either ran into a fog wall or inversion layer and turned into the mountain trying to get out. Whats interesting is the other two aircraft with this one landed okay.
Jim K said:
but helicopters seem to invite risky flying.
Click to expand...
No more than fixed wings take risks. Its more to do with the pilot and sometimes who is in back than the aircraft.
 
plenty of room for speculation with the info that’s been going around. Could be a combination of many factors.
 
"While Iranian state media said on Monday that the helicopter crash that killed President Ebrahim Raisi was the result of a “technical failure,” some Iran observers suggested that decades of international sanctions, which have caused the country’s aviation fleet to atrophy, might have played a role."

"while she did not have details of the circumstances surrounding Sunday’s fatal crash, it was telling that two of the country’s top leaders — Mr. Raisi and the foreign minister, Hossein Amir Abdollahian — were traveling in an aging helicopter. Iranian state media showed images of the crashed helicopter, a Bell 212, a model that was originally developed for the Canadian military in the 1960s, according to the Reuters news agency." -NYT
 
Racerx said:
I believe some of that has to do with the "E" in that PAVE checklist. Some external pressure from the folks riding in back.
Click to expand...
Seems like external pressure to not be the guy who killed the Prez would be pretty strong, too. ;)
 
ArrowFlyer86 said:
it was telling that two of the country’s top leaders — Mr. Raisi and the foreign minister, Hossein Amir Abdollahian — were traveling in an aging helicopter.
Click to expand...
All depends on ones perspective. There is a reason they were flying in a Bell 212 or 412 rather than in a MI-17. Even a new MI-17. But as to the sanctions being an issue, unfortunately there are plenty of routes around them to keep those aircraft flying especially for the head-shed. There is some discussion Raisi was on a 412 vs a 212 which would have made the aircraft much newer.
 
I expected someone called “Butcher of Tehran” would have face tattoos.
 
Factual Determination of Cause:
News article today quotes high-ranking Iranian official as blaming the US for this accident. (I do not joke)
Something about it’s our fault because we have denied them access to better equipment with the embargo.
(nothing to do with choosing to fly in horrible weather)
I’ll try to find it.

www.yahoo.com

Iran blames Western sanctions for fatal crash of US helicopter carrying Ebrahim Raisi

Mohammad Javad Zarif, Iran’s former foreign minister, has blamed US sanctions on aviation parts for the helicopter crash that killed the Islamic Republic’s president.
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Factual Determination of Cause:
News article today quotes high-ranking Iranian official as blaming the US for this accident. (I do not joke)
Something about it’s our fault because we have denied them access to better equipment with the embargo.
(nothing to do with choosing to fly in horrible weather)
I’ll try to find it.
Click to expand...
Maybe we denied them access to radar?
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Factual Determination of Cause:
News article today quotes high-ranking Iranian official as blaming the US for this accident. (I do not joke)
Something about it’s our fault because we have denied them access to better equipment with the embargo.
(nothing to do with choosing to fly in horrible weather)
I’ll try to find it.

www.yahoo.com

Iran blames Western sanctions for fatal crash of US helicopter carrying Ebrahim Raisi

Mohammad Javad Zarif, Iran’s former foreign minister, has blamed US sanctions on aviation parts for the helicopter crash that killed the Islamic Republic’s president.
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
Click to expand...

More embargo (like more cowbell).
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Factual Determination of Cause:
News article today quotes high-ranking Iranian official as blaming the US for this accident. (I do not joke)
Something about it’s our fault because we have denied them access to better equipment with the embargo.
(nothing to do with choosing to fly in horrible weather)
I’ll try to find it.

www.yahoo.com

Iran blames Western sanctions for fatal crash of US helicopter carrying Ebrahim Raisi

Mohammad Javad Zarif, Iran’s former foreign minister, has blamed US sanctions on aviation parts for the helicopter crash that killed the Islamic Republic’s president.
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
Click to expand...
They didn’t have to use a helo. Maybe they should have taken a goat or something…
 
Daleandee said:
Seems a bit odd that three copters were flying together and they lost one and had no idea where to look for it ...
Click to expand...
Three helicopters flying in very bad visibility. One hits the mountain because the mountain is obscured. The other two don't even notice, because... visibility is obscured. At some point, they do a check-in and realize... Hmm, lost a helo. Wonder where?
 
GaryM said:
Don't think we're gonna see an NTSB final report on this one.
Click to expand...

As the nation where the COA for the helo was issued, under icao rules the US would be an interested party in the investigation in a civilian accident. Military mishap, not so much.
 
Jim K said:
I'm guessing the guy ferrying Kobe around wasn't a hack of a pilot either, but helicopters seem to invite risky flying.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't call anyone a hack, but
his experience in IFR helicopter operations in the accident type twas the bare minimum.
 
Daleandee said:
Seems a bit odd that three copters were flying together and they lost one and had no idea where to look for it ...
Click to expand...
Not really. Its happened in other countries as well. Too many variables to guess but given the weather conditions and terrain it can be as simple the other two aircraft remained in the "clear" and landed.

There used to be a saying in the industry called "Land and Live" to promote using the unique capabilities of a helicopter when the weather goes south.

Maybe the 212 crew missed the memo? Or maybe Raisi was late for his next appointment. Have personally seen conditions change on a dime in the mountains and even in the GOM where things got interesting fast with no mountains around except oil platforms.
 
Oh the memes are brutal on this one.
 
kyleb said:
Three helicopters flying in very bad visibility. One hits the mountain because the mountain is obscured. The other two don't even notice, because... visibility is obscured. At some point, they do a check-in and realize... Hmm, lost a helo. Wonder where?
Click to expand...

Seems to me that having such high level folks on board would have meant there would have constant communication. "Breaker, breaker, one nine ... "
 
Daleandee said:
Seems to me that having such high level folks on board would have meant there would have constant communication. "Breaker, breaker, one nine ... "
Click to expand...
Yeah, but when helo 1 doesn't check in for 30 seconds, did he have a com failure? Did Allah summon him? Do you do a 360 in the clag to look for him?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top